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  #71  
Old 06-30-2005, 01:44 PM
oochappan's Avatar
oochappan oochappan is offline
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Default Re: you are also right Herve

Why not building it out on theme's we have already ? a simply theme of joining for the book would be easy like the Tsunami.
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  #72  
Old 06-30-2005, 02:13 PM
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oochappan oochappan is offline
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Default Re: you are also right Herve

A possibility to preview participants by
Book >> Theme
like you can select now
Earth >> Africa >> Cameroon f.i.
would be most pleasant, no ?
Then the most remarkable ressemblances or comparisions could be put together as teams by Theme, with maybe a possiblity for comments to involve opinions on it by Theme in a constructive or suggestive way could result in a pleasant combinations ..... don't know if this is possible on TE ?
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  #73  
Old 06-30-2005, 02:21 PM
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oochappan oochappan is offline
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Default Re: you are also right Herve

Something like
Book >> Theme >> photos >> comments
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  #74  
Old 06-30-2005, 02:45 PM
joseelias joseelias is offline
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Default Re: you are also right Herve

This task is far toooooooo big to select photos by placing them in a theme. For the Calendar, we had very specific areas (whit few images posted in TE) from which to choose, and the goal was somewhat clear. To show images of the affected areas where people and the sea where at peace. So there were only some hundreds to choose from initially and a few dozens later in the theme for the final choice.

In this case if people wish to make a generalist book youve got over 170.000 photos to select from - see why I believe that several thematic books are better?... The questions that can be aroused are:

How to select the images?
I think the only way to do this is to have filters to automatically sort some of them, and only after a manual choice must be made.

Now, the way this automatic filter can work I dont know, as well the criteria. We can think of using the number of points and separate at first all those that have over 20 points, and also consider looking those that have under this number of points but have many views like at least 400. Still we all know the questions the use of points arouses in these issues, so I think soon someone will question this criterion. Still, I cannot imagine the large thousands of images that a filter like this will select.

20 points is a good number because at the beginning there werent many people in TE so nice photos didnt get the galactic number of points they get nowadays, as well some less popular members have nowadays about this number for very good photo

Other options would be:
- to keep for the choice only the photos of 2002, 2003 and 2004. This would reduce the number of photos to select. And in the next year, if all went well there could be an edition of the 2005 photos and so on.
- For each member to be able to propose as eligible for the book a maximum of 5% of his posted photos. For example, someone with 200 photos could propose for inclusion in the book 10 images. These would be analyzed later. This has the advantage to include in the book only those members which are active and interested in the TE community. I dont care much for a nice photo from a member of 2003 which has abandoned TE meanwhile, if I have another as good from a current active member.

Who will select them?
But after these images are sorted a manual selection must be made. And heres another question. Who is sorting out the images? People from TE or someone from the outside?

The advantage of being people from TE is that it will be a team work with a higher number of people helping selecting the images. The disadvantage is that we are all amateurs with preferences and may eventually cast out images or themes that dont appeal to the general. For example, street-shots are only liked by some, but are in my opinion one of the most interesting forms of photography. How many of them will be chosen by the average TE member?...

People from the outside, with more professional skills, could be a choice but it would be probably only one and unable to do a clear sort of the photos. It would be a full time job for a long time. Also he could be biased to choose some types of photos of his preference too.
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  #75  
Old 06-30-2005, 05:14 PM
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dom_inik_m dom_inik_m is offline
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Default Let's try not to reinvent the wheel...

Making a book requires to rely on a few basics:
- a good idea (or a series of ideas)
- publishing and circulation openings (at least if print is the sole required option)
- contributors (photographers, digital pp specialists, creative director, layout integrators, writers, translators, proof-readers, accountant...)
- last but not least, someone in charge (or a selected group of people, with clear goals and roles)!
Managing this kind of project really requires a full-time commitment, often more than that... Trust me, I know from experience, having conceived and published many books, magazines and digital media projects for the last 20 years.
And all this requires money, too. It's quite useless to have a strong concept if no one will be able to turn it real by lack of financing.

So, before deciding who'll sort pictures, I think it would be more sensible to start answering some fundamental questions first:
What? Sorry but a book on learning about the world through photography is not good enough, it reflect a way too wide approach...
When? End of 2005?
What frequency? Only one book? A collection? A yearly companion?
Why? Beware what Filip wrote earlier about vanity...
For whom? Target audience, etc.
Who's in charge? Since this is not some "one author", authority becomes the key word...
With whom? Members from TE with good will is not sufficient either (in any production process, whether amateur or professional, missing a deadline can prove to be extremely costly!)... For exemple, if Henk's multicultural and multilingual suggestion were to be followed (the best practical approach I've read so far on this thread, in my humble opinion), selected photographers should also have some writing talent...
How?
How long will it take?
How much will it cost?
All these topics are closely inter-related, of course...

Once these topics are firmly set, then we'll be on to something!

Food for thought...
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  #76  
Old 06-30-2005, 06:58 PM
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kikvel kikvel is offline
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Default mi english is so bad that it is really difficult for me...

to express myself correctly, forgive me this

What?
I think this is a matter of decision, the site name TrekEARTH is a nice one; the book can be treated as a compilation of pictures of all over the world. Mainly pictures of people, showing the different cultures and also landscapes of all the regions.
I do not see wrong in having this approach. I just imagine myself 300 pages of only portraits...or only landscapes...

But if we have such quantity of pages wouldnt be nice to see the whole world in pictures? People, festivals, landscapes, decisive moments all of them supported by the photographer`s notes and having the book organized in continents, or time zones?
I see that if we stick to something narrow, like pictures of Spain only, the interest would be also narrowed by this very first decision.

When?
This process can be as long as we want. This depends mainly on the decision and quick action of the persons involved.
I see two main sets of colaborators:
- One group of administrators.
- One group of content providers. (the owners of the pictures).
If the process is kept simple this can be achieved in more or less 9 months, so with this we will reach 2006 easily, but...who is in a rush?
We are all supposed to love photography and this is the main reason why we spend so much time here. Wouldnt you feel happy to be part of a bigger project? Doing what you already like?
The other way is to convert this into a Babel tower...

What frequency?
I hope this can be done on a yearly basis. I foresee a yearly edition.
This can be also a booster on your already established habit of shooting. Now, you may be chosen to be selected to be part of the book.
I think this may help to have a stronger community.

Why?
Because we have the skills, we have the content and we love to work with image related tasks. This is like a normal and logical step on our community. I think, maybe I am totally wrong.
Why do you post here? A specific reason? Money? Glory? Vanity? Every one might have an own ambition, a desire, and I do not see anything wrong here. As far as we agree regarding the destination of the revenues, for instance, charity, etc etc.

For whom?
Initially for our own community, but this can be sold also outside TE, to a bigger market. The revenues generated can be donated, or can be expended in having better and faster servers for our own community. Something that we may enjoy alltogether.
The very first book will be a test. We do not have neither to save the world or become millionaires with it. I see it just more for the pleasure of doing it. As a challenge. Of course this is my opinion.
I would personally buy one for myself.

Who's in charge?
This is part of the definitions. We have to start from scracth, I do not see other way. And we will build stone by stone an structure to accomplish our goal.

With whom?
I believe that initially we have to do it by ourselves.

How?
By having so many skillful resources and having an efficient assignation of tasks.

How long will it take?
I already mentioned an estimation of 9 months. I am working on a project chart, to have a more accurate view of the whole process.

How much will it cost?
Less than you can imagine, if we can allocate resources within TE, and if we have the willingness to do it.

K.
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  #77  
Old 06-30-2005, 08:54 PM
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donluicu donluicu is offline
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Default wow...so manyideas...

First of all , i would say that it's great to have so many ideas...
I agree with joseelias, he got some good choosing ideas.
I agree too with the fact that we have to choose a book with themes (love, work, weather...)
For example, why don't we show "LOVE" in France, or Italy, or India or Canada...with X pics (selectionned by somebody..who?) beside each pic, the author's note in two languages (english as the universal language, and the author's language, that would be fun to see hebrew, indy, french...beside the english..)
I hope you understand what i mean, because my written english is not so good...;-(

see you soon.

Loc
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  #78  
Old 06-30-2005, 09:58 PM
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rutti rutti is offline
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Default more cents

I think it is a good ida to make the book according to the meaning of TE and in that case the title would be "Learning about our world through photography". If we chose photos that has alot of substance I think it'll be narrow enough.

I don't know anything about printing and stuff but I fear that most images posted here on TE doesn't meet the quality needed for bookprinting. For example my originals are 1600*1200*24b and that's not good enough, is it? The professional people here must have better originals but that only accounts for a small group of people.

Also it would be nice if we can use the usernames when we refer to people. I haven't been a member for long so I don't know wich one of you have the unofficial nickname "Henk" (because I didn't find a user with that name).
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  #79  
Old 06-30-2005, 10:53 PM
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dom_inik_m dom_inik_m is offline
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Default Universal language

Should there be one, I vote for Esperanto...
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  #80  
Old 06-30-2005, 11:05 PM
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jrj jrj is offline
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Default Re: Trekearth Book

I have seen the dialouge with proposals of themes etc IE: Love. with all respect: Love is not a central theme in TE.

Should a book be published it must reflect TE and it's intention:

Learn about the world through photography.

It should present if not all, a large part of countries. As there is a diversion in main interest at TE, simply: Photos of people and photos of landscapes (incl. cities etc), there should for each country selected be represented 2 photos: 1 with focus on people. 1 with focus on landscape.

The selcted photos should be taken from someone not native in the country. Each photo accompanied by the photographers notes and a short intro (one sentence) of the photographer.

The book should not be 'gigantic'. Representing all parts of world maybe 200 pages. It means of course selction and not all and everybody can be represented.

Finally: I enter this discussion with doubt as I react again at statements of the type given by kinginexile which I comment below (kinginexiles statements in italic):

and so-so shots from very popular members

When the pestering of some very popular members is put aside - maybe they even come forward in the discussion...

Sorry for being frank again

Could be interesting to know Herve if you really mean that the so-so shots from very popular members not include anything that could be worth a closer look - OR should the photos worth looking at not at all come from any popular members - if so: WHY.

OR: If you tried to say that it will be important to look for quality photos undependent of the photographers position on TE, old/new, many/few photos, many/few points etc. - well then I guess you or anyone with english as motherlanuage should do it without using negative references to so-so shots from popular members. I sense an arrogance in these kind of statements that I think is unecessary in an otherwise interesting discussion around this project.

If you have anything negative to photos from whoever you classify as a popular member: Use the critics and stop making cheap points in discussions as here.

Let's keep this prosject going by a general posetive attitude.
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