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  #11  
Old 01-30-2005, 10:02 PM
kikvel kikvel is offline
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Default very fine contribution Luko

Very fine, very interesting to read about.
Many thanks

K.
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  #12  
Old 01-31-2005, 12:29 AM
kikvel kikvel is offline
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Default Re: INteresting thread Sohrab

I think Sohrab that the reason to what you ask is quite clear.

And I do not think that TE is against the world. I believe there are more landscapers than portraiters.
And i can not imagine TE without landscapes. I disagree that landscapes are boring. At least not to my eyes. I like photography with all motifs, being animals, people, landscapes, portraits, etc etc.

I enjoyed them all, I do not have to be HCB to enjoy photography, my motivations are quite simple and they are not intended necessarily to become ending in wordly awarded photos.

Of course we are all different, and so are our motivations and goals.

Be well;

K.
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  #13  
Old 01-31-2005, 04:58 AM
thien thien is offline
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Default Re: TREKEARTH VS THE WORLD

Being a sefl-professed landscaper, I was first stripped naked by Luko guard and now you planted my confiscated swiss-army knife right on my back :D.

Funny, I thought there are more "people-oriented" photographers here than the landscape type. At least, my people pictures seems to attract more comments than the "not-another-postcard" shots. And I always thought my "dead-thing" shots are always better than the "it's-alive" stuffs.

As why there are more landscape shots than people shots. Most of us here lives in the West or at least in more "technologically advance" countries and along with that, the fear of sticking our lens towards another being (or at least the fear of the punch going back toward the lens). Second thing is we are not all artistic souls and can immediately appreciate a HCB just like not many people can "get" a Picasso. It takes time to appreciate a context picture which at first, look horribly boring (I still scratch my head at most pictures in the Magnum Degrees book) . A good landscape picture can easily lift your spirit. However, like all things after seeing too many sunsets, you kind of getting jagged too. The same applies to people portraits, unless there is a gleam in the personality of the people in the portrait, it is just another sympathic image.

But at the end when we have reached the stage of capable of expression through our images, our pictures not only tell about the subjects in the image but also tell others a bit about who we are. It could be complex for some of us has a complex personality. It could be wild and unpredictable as your untamed character. It could be magic for the daydreamers. I choose landscape as my medium, who can guess who am I? ;)
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  #14  
Old 01-31-2005, 05:55 AM
sohrab sohrab is offline
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Default Re: And how about...

hi actually this is a good point
i wrote my messages in a hurry..
i meant context VS plain landscapes
i didn't mean plain upclose people portrait photographers

"Yann Arthus-Bertrand"

ok i've never heard of him, but will definitely look him up.. so that means
yeah i guess my questioning was biased, but at the same time i didn't intend to put landscape photography down in anyway. was just wondering what people really look for in whatever kind of photographs they like :)
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  #15  
Old 01-31-2005, 03:35 PM
kikvel kikvel is offline
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Default Re: TREKEARTH VS THE WORLD

very nice point Thien, you are right, I feel that all the people do not get as many opportunities of shooting people engaged in activities and with an exotic environments as one may have by being in a so beautiful country, full of colours, and people like India.

I guess India is the paradise for photographers, and you have more opportunities to grow there if you are interested in HCB type photos.

Many of us live in urban environments where people do not want to be photographed at all.
I have seen different reactions here in my country, ranging from extreme kindness to verbal agression.

So I guess this depends also on where you are and what opportunities you have, and what your goals are.

K.
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  #16  
Old 01-31-2005, 04:28 PM
sohrab sohrab is offline
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Default Re: TREKEARTH VS THE WORLD

hi thein
sorry i missed out on your post earlier
i think your reply makes a lot of sense and is putting my restlessness to rest to some extent :)

i'm just really curious to try and figure out what goes in a viewer's mind.

"Second thing is we are not all artistic souls and can immediately appreciate a HCB just like not many people can "get" a Picasso. It takes time to appreciate a context picture which at first, look horribly boring (I still scratch my head at most pictures in the Magnum Degrees book) . A good landscape picture can easily lift your spirit"


hmmm i think you're absolutely right here.
i wonder why this didn't strike me at first. anyway thanks for taking the time to write. i appreciate it
take care
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  #17  
Old 01-31-2005, 10:57 PM
sengir sengir is offline
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Default Re: TREKEARTH VS THE WORLD

I must agree with everything you wrote here.

First, I also have a feeling that people shots "sell" better here than landscapes. And I saw much more good people shots here than good(!!!) landscape shots.

Second, in many western countries photographing people in the streets is getting more and more "dangerous" - in some countries you can even be sued - that's why you will see much less people pictures from Europe than from Asia.

Third - as thien said, it also requires some artistic sensitivity to fully appreciate pictures of HCB or other great authors. Or at least some time - I believe it requires some maturity, some lets say experience to be able to "see". Not surprisingly most kids are bored in museums :).
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  #18  
Old 02-01-2005, 12:15 AM
dom_inik_m dom_inik_m is offline
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Default And...

unsurprisingly, most people here are not interested by pictures of people in relation with the most human sensitivities of all: art, creation and questionning their relationship to the universe, whatever essential or mundane it may seem.
Better be filled with wonder on flaming sunsets and cloudy skies...
Better marvel over the smiles or frowns of unknown passer-bys in faraway streets...

But always grumble on photos with unsufficient notes and perceptions of the photographer according to any specific shot!
I fear this site is on the verge of becoming pointless with the endless repetition of postcards, multiple artificial enhanced post-production effects and politically correct views of a largely fantasized planet.

Why do we see less pictures of "people" from Europe (what about North America?) than Asia?
Certainly not because western countries has become dangerous; I live here and know my environment, with my own limitations through my camera lens.
Certainly because some of them may have become more stupid, deaf and blind. But mostly because of a definite "exotic" perception of the world - complacent or colonial have been similar terms in their own times - which finds a subliminal representation here. Whether this comes from a natural and aesthetic inclination or a form of individual freedom unleashed away from home, I don't know. But the result is there, while I still believe that the way you look at what's happening around you changes as soon as you step out of your home (or look through your window).

Let us ask ourselves what we really want, why we'd like it to be put in practice and how to react accordingly to what we see and feel: not TreakEarth vs. the world, but what kind of world do we live in through TrekEarth...
Sound controversy or bland considerations?
Thank you Sohrab for starting this thread. I feel that time's come to address the real subject, now... ;-)
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  #19  
Old 02-01-2005, 02:47 AM
cgrindahl cgrindahl is offline
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Default Re: TrekEarth AND the World

This is a wonderful conversation. I'll through my two cents worth in here. I'm a beginner, learning how to use a camera and discovering what kinds of photography stirs my interest. I put my old Nikon camer down many years ago while traveling in Italy when it suddenly dawned on me that I was mistaking a picture taken with the real experience of BEING in a place. The rest of the trip I used my journal to record reactions to what I'd experienced.

Picking up a camera today, I'm mindful of the fact that every time I lift a camera and lens between myself and another human being I'm creating separation. If my interest is in meeting another human being, in plumbing the depths of intimacy possible between human beings, it will surely not be improved by lifting a camera to my face. The photographer is eternally a voyeur. He or she steps out of the moment to capture what his or her mind says is important to record. It may be considered a creative act, but it will always be a personal, subjective interpretation. Intimacy arises in the moment and certainly can be shared. Meaning accrues only later upon reflection. It is not a shared event, but a personal result of introspection.

Certainly, portraiture, or decisive moment photography can be engaging, even fascinating, as many human ventures are. As Cesar mentioned in this discussion, the only thing that really matters is that our work behind the camera gives us joy. For some that means using photography to portray human verities. That surely is wonderful, yet I'm reminded that the human spirit is touched by many things, from fine music to great art. We live, of course, in a world much coarsened by events of the last century. Photography has given us an opportunity to look squarely at the monsters created along the way, yet it seems every equally useful in these troubled times to appreciate a beautiful vista that has the potential to lift one's spirit.

TrekEarth attracts ordinary folks who live in places we know, and occasionally love. I happen to live in one of the most beautiful places on earth and I really enjoy sharing it with others. And I love learning about other parts of the world I've not visited. I also enjoy conventional portraits, especially when done well. I don't need "profound" photographs ala HCB, to understand the human condition. I feel fully capable, in myself, in my life, to meet what life has to offer, including the suffering and celebration that exists all around me. I'll enjoy such photographs, but to suggest they are the only such works of value, simply seems foolish to me.
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  #20  
Old 02-01-2005, 08:13 AM
efimoore efimoore is offline
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Default Re: TREKEARTH VS THE WORLD

sohrab,

Adding a few thoughts to try and answer your questions: Maybe a big difference is what motivates the photographers. Many of the people in TE are enthusiastic amateurs with out any intention of becoming famous photographers. Something else motivates them.
Another thing most of TE members are from Europe and North America. And the chance of meeting someone colorful and photogenic to picture is relatively low.
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